Dealing with Bruce

[Henry]

This is Henrick's site so he sets the rules for etiquette.

My suggestion is that we approach issues with Bruce's manner of expression in two ways:

1) Bruce begins to realize that many of the participants in this forum are from Europe where in my experience folks tend not to be as willing to offend as those of us who grew up in New Jersey and New York. As Bruce realizes this, he attempts to tone down his use of expletives and insults, but does not water down his views, and

2) Those of us who are a bit sensitive to the use of expletives and other spartan descriptions of music by Bruce attempt to be more tolerant of such expressions except in the most offensive instances.

Good luck to all if you choose to take action based on the suggestions above, and please provide additional suggestions if you believe they may help us work through this situation.

[JimmyJazz]

Or, simply ignore his boloney (I'm using a more polite word than the one I would like to.) Like Henrik said, just turn him into a foe and you don't have to deal with him anyways. Also, whether he's from the East Coast or not is meaningless. You, Nick, Jirin, and Listyguy all are from that region, and none of you guys talk that way. He is just a troll, and nothing more.

[Jirin]

I don't think the problem is what he's saying so much as how he's saying it. There's a difference between giving a negative review and trashing.

This is a negative review: http://www.popmatters.com/review/black- ... traumatic/
This is trashing: http://pitchfork.com/reviews/albums/116 ... traumatic/

If you want to criticize something you know people to like, be more Roger Ebert and less Rex Reed.

And definitely don't be this guy:

[Listyguy]

Are we just assuming he won't read this thread?
And I don't think my problem with him has to do with him being from NY or him not liking the same music as a lot of us. It's his mannerisms. Henry hates the VU, but he never expresses his opinion of this in a way nearly as volatile as Bruce.

How exactly did he get unbanned from the forum? He claimed Henrik let him back, but I highly doubt that actually happened.

[JimmyJazz]

Are we just assuming he won't read this thread?
And I don't think my problem with him has to do with him being from NY or him not liking the same music as a lot of us. It's his mannerisms. Henry hates the VU, but he never expresses his opinion of this in a way nearly as volatile as Bruce.

How exactly did he get unbanned from the forum? He claimed Henrik let him back, but I highly doubt that actually happened.

That's NJ he comes from actually, as you will find out in his very tasteful bashing of the entire nation of Canada in that stupid trollin' thread that got locked.

I also really don't care if he does read this thread. He knows we all can't stand him anyways, and he almost never goes to this section of the forum.

Yet, his problem IS very much the acts he doesn't like, besides his very "putrid" mannerisms. I don't mean to say it is bad that he dislikes say, the VU or Captain Beefheart or Nirvana. It is that he consistently hates (and vocally and "objectively") dismisses pretty much ALL of the acts that are favorites on this forum, not just one or two. Of course, plenty of us are fans of much of the early rock n roll, classic r&b, rootsy blues, and 60s pop he enjoys, myself included (although his doo wop stuff truly bores me, in all honesty). However, this forum is also passionately interested in more alternative and artistically complex acts as well who explore the greater boundaries of pop.

I'm going to provide a list of acts here:

- Nirvana
- Radiohead
- The Velvet Underground (as well as Lou Reed and John Cale)
- Frank Zappa
- Captain Beefheart
- David Bowie
- Pink Floyd
- The Stooges
- Pixies
- The Smiths
- Jimi Hendrix
- Patti Smith
- Bjork
- Arcade Fire
- Joni Mitchell
- Leonard Cohen
- Tom Waits
- Kraftwerk
- Most jazz and all classical

Now, obviously everyone on the forum may not love everyone of these acts or genres, but they usually like at least SOME of the aforementioned acts. However, this guy seems to have a pretty consistent hate-on for every single forum favorite. This is simply not normal, I could probably find somebody down the road (to indulge in some Bruce-isms myself, and find somebody who appreciates one of these acts). This guy seems to actively just reject all of them, even when it does not seem realistic. All of this furthers my overall point that he is just an irritating troll.

Sorry for the long tirade.

[irreduciblekoan]

I've purposefully tried to avoid getting into discussions with Bruce. (Of course, I don't participate in this forum as much as I'd like to, overall. I have yet to partake in any poll, for example, which I feel bad about but I'm honestly not one for polls because I'm terrible at organizing what I like.) While perusing the threads over the months though, I have frequently read Bruce's posts. Well, I'm usually very lenient and liberal about how people express themselves on the internet. I know that being a jerk doesn't always mean being a troll. Some people are more blunt than others. However, I agree with the negative comments here and elsewhere and I would have to call Bruce a troll, as much as he has "attempted" to listen to music he dislikes, and as much as he is knowledgeable about some things. I find it truly hard to believe that he hates as much good music as he claims he does. But even if he does, the way he goes about expressing his dislike of such artists is truly distasteful.

His contradictory nature also frustrates me. He frequently states that music cannot be written about. But I feel like that is just his excuse to write bluntly about the music he dislikes. He certainly loves to say what he hates, and how much he hates it, post after post after post, while saying again and again that "tastes" cannot be written about. Therefore he seems to think that gives him a free pass to not attempt to defend his opinions further than "this artist fucking sucks." I would have to differ with him. Maybe it is true that tastes cannot be written out, but it is also possible to explain one's taste for or against a work of art, or to discuss one's likes and dislikes in a respectful manner. Instead of saying "I hate Captain Beefheart because the motherfucker can't sing and his songs are weird" he could just as easily "Beefheart's voice is, to me, not conventionally attractive enough for my tastes and his music is a bit too atonal for me." That's a way of "writing about music" in a way that is understandable and respectful.

Well, now that I wrote all that out, I actually hope he DOES read this thread.

[Blanco]

Personally, What I disliked about him before it was not his language or the fact that he does not like the same music as me, but their inconsistent arguments and fallacies. Although somehow I like that he likes so much to discuss, despite being so bad at it. Somehow I find it funny. It's like a child discussing serious issues, but with many years of dogmatic beliefs behind! He can not say why he likes more a color than another, for example. When I was 4, if anyone asked me what color I liked, I would answer that red, because it was the color of the main Power Ranger. Hahaha. When I realized that Bruce just could not answer (and did not even try), I started to see him more as an entertainment:

"Hey Bruce, the lyrics of that song blablabla"
"I have zero interest in lyrics!"
"Hey Bruce, what's so special about Christmas songs?
"The lyrics. Oh ugh, well, and they also have bell's sounds."

Hahahaha That man is a monument to inconsistency, and I like that. It has given me laughter in return for the hours I lost reading what he writes.

The image of him sitting so many hours a day on the computer but writing about blowjobs, collapses any attempt to take me seriously anything he says. Or the fact that there are these accounts of people who connect once a month, but when they do it is to support the arguments of Bruce, using exactly the same form of expression and the same language... gives pity.

But even with that, the Random Rules of December has been my favorite because of the humor of the participants thanks to Bruce nonsense. And he knows it. He knows that writing about "Nevermind" will not make us change our minds (especially with the way he writes). And yet, he continues writing. Why? I don't know. But he knows he entertains. He knows that his musical knowledge are based on a small range of years from a small geographic region, and that any music he hears, he will value it comparing it with that small range. Poor thing.
There is only one thing that can bother me of him: his racism.
So, if he is banned from the forum, that's fine for me. If he stays, that's fine too.
I just have this feeling that there are people who will not join the forum because of him.

[DocBrown]

While Henry, as a lawyer, can tell us that using another man's words in a court of law is inadmissable, it is an irony of the law that we must use one's words and actions to infer their motives and intents. As a case in point...

Muddy Waters supporting Eric Clapton at the Concertgebow - that should please Bruce

What Mr. Clapton may have thought, "What an honour, to share a stage with one of my idols..."

What Mr. Waters may have thought, "What an opportunity, to play before tens of thousands of young European fans with little or no experience of authentic American blues..."

What Dave and tens of thousands of fans may have thought, "What a thrill, to see two legends play back-to-back..."

What a troll might have thought, "hmm, I'd like to see one presumably heterosexual man perform oral sex on another..."

Just sayin'

[JimmyJazz]

While Henry, as a lawyer, can tell us that using another man's words in a court of law is inadmissable, it is an irony of the law that we must use one's words and actions to infer their motives and intents. As a case in point...

Muddy Waters supporting Eric Clapton at the Concertgebow - that should please Bruce

What Mr. Clapton may have thought, "What an honour, to share a stage with one of my idols..."

What Mr. Waters may have thought, "What an opportunity, to play before tens of thousands of young European fans with little or no experience of authentic American blues..."

What Dave and tens of thousands of fans may have thought, "What a thrill, to see two legends play back-to-back..."

What a troll might have thought, "hmm, I'd like to see one presumably heterosexual man perform oral sex on another..."

Just sayin'

nice one, Doc!

[Mattceinicram]

I
This is trashing: http://pitchfork.com/reviews/albums/116 ... traumatic/

If you want to criticize something you know people to like, be more Roger Ebert and less Rex Reed.

I really hope he didn't get paid for that review...

Anyway I guess I just ignore Bruce. I realize I have no interest in him and he really doesn't real share any interest in the music most of us love here. Honestly, I don't get what attracts Bruce here except for the fact that it's an opportunity for him to to troll. He has a far greater knowledge of early pre 60s music than any of us here, and I appreciate that. I just wish he'd realize that there is more music beyond that and that he should appreciate our knowledge as well.

[Henry]

Are we just assuming he won't read this thread?
And I don't think my problem with him has to do with him being from NY or him not liking the same music as a lot of us. It's his mannerisms. Henry hates the VU, but he never expresses his opinion of this in a way nearly as volatile as Bruce.

How exactly did he get unbanned from the forum? He claimed Henrik let him back, but I highly doubt that actually happened.

I am assuming that Bruce will read this thread, and my goal is to help him understand how he can get along without feeling that he's censoring or stifling himself.

One more point. I do not hate VU, I just think that they are wildly over-rated