AM demographics poll 2017 - genders

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What's your gender?

Male
56
92%
Female
3
5%
Other
2
3%
 
Total votes: 61

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Pierre
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AM demographics poll 2017 - genders

Post by Pierre » Sun Oct 01, 2017 7:48 am

And now, the last part of the demographics poll, as requested by Dexter. Please surprise me.

We live interesting times regarding the redefining of gender identities, and the male/female dichotomy is more and more discussed, hence the "Other" option. I don't expect it to be used a lot, but you never know.

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Re: AM demographics poll 2017 - genders

Post by Dexter » Sun Oct 01, 2017 9:16 am

This poll is currently relevant if you follow the discussions on the Album poll results, i.e., correlation between the results of albums by female artists vis-a-vis female voters. My guess is that out of the 75 who participated in the last poll (assuming all do so again in this one) the female population in the forum don't exceed single digit and I'll be surprised if it even reaches 7.

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Re: AM demographics poll 2017 - genders

Post by Pierre » Sun Oct 01, 2017 10:56 am

Dexter wrote:This poll is currently relevant if you follow the discussions on the Album poll results, i.e., correlation between the results of albums by female artists vis-a-vis female voters. My guess is that out of the 75 who participated in the last poll (assuming all do so again in this one) the female population in the forum don't exceed single digit and I'll be surprised if it even reaches 7.
Yeah, I briefly followed this in the Album poll thread. And I expect a similar result to this poll as you do, which is why I said in the opening message "Please surprise me". The opening salvo of votes doesn't really.

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Re: AM demographics poll 2017 - genders

Post by Pierre » Sun Oct 01, 2017 7:10 pm

Well, someone actually immediately used the "Other" option. I'd be interested to know if it's just a joke vote or a real statement.

Otherwise, the result so far is as expected.

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Re: AM demographics poll 2017 - genders

Post by BleuPanda » Sun Oct 01, 2017 7:26 pm

Pierre wrote:Well, someone actually immediately used the "Other" option. I'd be interested to know if it's just a joke vote or a real statement.

Otherwise, the result so far is as expected.
I voted for other. My whole identity thing lately has been kind of confusing.

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Re: AM demographics poll 2017 - genders

Post by Pierre » Mon Oct 02, 2017 6:52 am

BleuPanda wrote:
Pierre wrote:Well, someone actually immediately used the "Other" option. I'd be interested to know if it's just a joke vote or a real statement.

Otherwise, the result so far is as expected.
I voted for other. My whole identity thing lately has been kind of confusing.
Sorry to hear that, I didn't know. I hope you'll manage to sort things out.

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Re: AM demographics poll 2017 - genders

Post by BleuPanda » Mon Oct 02, 2017 12:47 pm

Well, I think I have it figured out; it's just hard to meaningfully convey to other people.

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Re: AM demographics poll 2017 - genders

Post by Henrik » Mon Oct 02, 2017 4:21 pm

BleuPanda, as someone who has also done a bit of thinking of who I am (although not regarding my gender) the last couple of years, I hope you're pleased with what you have figured out about yourself.

I don't know if your signature is new. At least I haven't paid attention to it before. But as much as I know you, I think you are a very insightful and loving person.
Everyone you meet fights a battle you know nothing about. Be kind. Always.

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Re: AM demographics poll 2017 - genders

Post by BleuPanda » Mon Oct 02, 2017 4:37 pm

Henrik wrote:BleuPanda, as someone who has also done a bit of thinking of who I am (although not regarding my gender) the last couple of years, I hope you're pleased with what you have figured out about yourself.

I don't know if your signature is new. At least I haven't paid attention to it before. But as much as I know you, I think you are a very insightful and loving person.

My signature's been this for a while; it's the ending theme song of the cartoon Steven Universe.

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Re: AM demographics poll 2017 - genders

Post by Pierre » Tue Oct 03, 2017 8:16 am

Interesting to see that there already two "Other" while we still don't have a vote for "Female"... Didn't see that one coming. Otherwise, the results so far confirm that the AM community is decidedly testosterone-fueled.

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Re: AM demographics poll 2017 - genders

Post by veganvalentine » Tue Oct 03, 2017 8:55 am

I wonder why there are no women; it really is striking.

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Re: AM demographics poll 2017 - genders

Post by Henrik » Wed Oct 04, 2017 6:26 am

So, currently 42 males and 0 females. Even worse than I thought. Makes me wonder if there could still be a few women among us, but no one wants to be hunted down as "the only girl in the forum".

It is an appalling thought that this would be a unwelcoming forum to women. :(
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Re: AM demographics poll 2017 - genders

Post by Dexter » Wed Oct 04, 2017 7:00 am

I can count four usernames with feminine sounding names and I'm fairly certain that one of them is female and yeah it's a intimidating thought to be the only woman in the forum. I'm interested if you plan to do something about this Henrik - making the forum appeal more to the opposite sex? ...if ever there's such a method.

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Re: AM demographics poll 2017 - genders

Post by Pierre » Wed Oct 04, 2017 8:05 am

Henrik wrote:So, currently 42 males and 0 females. Even worse than I thought. Makes me wonder if there could still be a few women among us, but no one wants to be hunted down as "the only girl in the forum".

It is an appalling thought that this would be a unwelcoming forum to women. :(
Dexter wrote:I can count four usernames with feminine sounding names and I'm fairly certain that one of them is female and yeah it's a intimidating thought to be the only woman in the forum. I'm interested if you plan to do something about this Henrik - making the forum appeal more to the opposite sex? ...if ever there's such a method.
I'm not entirely sure the forum is unwelcoming to women. We all know that the AM forum is one of the most peaceful and tolerant place on the Web.

I've been wondering for some time if it's not because the acclaimed music as showcased on this website isn't appealing to women. I am NOT saying women have poor tastes in music (it wouldn't even occur to me) but maybe they have a very different conception of what great music is compared to what AM suggests. After all, a lot of if not almost every list featured on AM were built by critics who are identified as males, with a significantly inferior input by women. So perhaps, lists that would be compiled from female critics only would look very different.

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Re: AM demographics poll 2017 - genders

Post by Moonbeam » Wed Oct 04, 2017 11:46 am

Sigh. It seems that music forums in general are very male-dominated, and we certainly do suffer for it. I don't know what could be done to try to get more participation from women, but I'd be willing to help out if we came up with some ideas.

One (probably stupid) idea is to have a poll where we rank our favorite female artists (or albums, or songs) and try to advertise it beyond the forum somehow.

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Re: AM demographics poll 2017 - genders

Post by BleuPanda » Thu Oct 05, 2017 9:58 pm

So we might really have more genderqueer people than women? Huh...

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Re: AM demographics poll 2017 - genders

Post by Pierre » Sun Oct 15, 2017 8:39 am

Bumping this. The result is just as depressing as the last time we checked it...

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Re: AM demographics poll 2017 - genders

Post by nicolas » Sun Oct 15, 2017 10:58 am

Hey guys, are your girlfriends / wives / sisters / mothers fond of LISTS ?
My wife hates lists.

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Re: AM demographics poll 2017 - genders

Post by jamieW » Sun Oct 15, 2017 12:43 pm

nicolas wrote:Hey guys, are your girlfriends / wives / sisters / mothers fond of LISTS ?
My wife hates lists.
My wife's never said as much, but I'm sure she thinks my incessant list-making is borderline insane. While I never would've thought such a thing would be gender-specific, the results of this poll are not encouraging. (Especially since I thought for certain we had at least one regular female participant and another who votes from time to time. It just goes to show I should never make assumptions based upon usernames. :P In fact, it was before my time, but wasn't one of the most legendary AM members - NJ - believed to be female for quite a while?)

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Re: AM demographics poll 2017 - genders

Post by Nick » Sun Oct 15, 2017 1:06 pm

nicolas wrote:Hey guys, are your girlfriends / wives / sisters / mothers fond of LISTS ?
My wife hates lists.
My girlfriend doesn't like lists. She claims that she can't place things in order like I can.

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Re: AM demographics poll 2017 - genders

Post by Pierre » Sun Oct 15, 2017 1:17 pm

jamieW wrote:In fact, it was before my time, but wasn't one of the most legendary AM members - NJ - believed to be female for quite a while?
Ha ha, I remember that :D I joined AM in the very last moments of netjade's contributions here, but that was still pretty funny. I think it had to do with his Facebook profile picture, but the Great Ancients - nicolas, Nassim, Stephan, Honorio, Moonbeam or Henrik - might have a better picture.

Man, do I miss NJ. This guy was endlessly entertaining to read.

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Re: AM demographics poll 2017 - genders

Post by jamieW » Sun Oct 15, 2017 1:49 pm

Pierre wrote:
jamieW wrote:In fact, it was before my time, but wasn't one of the most legendary AM members - NJ - believed to be female for quite a while?
Ha ha, I remember that :D I joined AM in the very last moments of netjade's contributions here, but that was still pretty funny. I think it had to do with his Facebook profile picture, but the Great Ancients - nicolas, Nassim, Stephan, Honorio, Moonbeam or Henrik - might have a better picture.

Man, do I miss NJ. This guy was endlessly entertaining to read.
That's what I remember, as well! He had an enigmatic, poetic way of writing (with a good sense of humor, too) that I enjoyed reading. Since I began tuning in during the later days (and caught up in the old forum), I remember him being a little frustrated that the forum was becoming more mainstream and not giving lesser known music a chance. His all-time albums list was great, though. He was even less mainstream than sonofsamiam and Mindrocker, and it'd be great to have his recommendations back again. (Though I don't think having Evanescence on my list is going to lure him back anytime soon.) :mrgreen:

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Re: AM demographics poll 2017 - genders

Post by Honorio » Sun Oct 15, 2017 2:40 pm

jamieW wrote:While I never would've thought such a thing would be gender-specific, the results of this poll are not encouraging. (Especially since I thought for certain we had at least one regular female participant and another who votes from time to time. It just goes to show I should never make assumptions based upon usernames. :P In fact, it was before my time, but wasn't one of the most legendary AM members - NJ - believed to be female for quite a while?)
Yes, we have a regular female participant here. At least she is registered on RateYourMusic as female. But probably she is too shy to show up in this thread as the only girl on the Forum. But there's no need to be shy at all, her lists are excellent and her views on music are really refreshing. Hope she don't mind that I copy and paste her basic views on music from her Rateyourmusic account. I agree in most of the points, especially points 3 to 6.

"Basic views on music:
1. There are four kinds of music: classical, jazz, pop and world music. I use "pop music" in the broadest sense of the word, including rock, soul, hip hop, chanson etc. "World music" includes traditional music from all countries and folk music.
2. My album lists focus mainly on pop music in this broad sense, although list before 1970 also include a number of jazz albums and lists of more recent years also include a number of world music albums.
3. I don't believe in a distinction between "mainstream" and "alternative" music. Those are meaningless terms invented by critics to make people believe that their own taste is superior to that of others. I don't believe there's a clear distinction between rock and pop; many of my favorite albums are somewhere on the borderline between those two.
4. Lists in rock magazines and on the Internet are usually dominated by British and American male rock stars. There's a bias against women and non-English artists. There should be much more diversity.
5. Vocal quality, sound, harmony, rhythm, melody and lyrics are what matter to me, regardless of the reputation or "street credibility" of an artist.
6. I don't believe in target groups. If I like a teen pop or an "adult contemporary" album, I just put it in my list of favorite albums. Those divisions mean nothing to me, they're meaningless labels.
7. Sounding subtle and poetic has more merit than sounding loud and agressive.
8. The best way to listen to music is alone with your headphones on.
9. Pop music can be art, but it's certainly entertainment. There's nothing wrong with being sexy or funny.
10. If I like it I like it, no matter what anyone else says. There is no such thing as a guilty pleasure. People should never feel ashamed for liking something, nor adjust their taste to confirm to others."

By the way, if you don't agree with what I have just done and prefer to remain anonymous please tell me by means of a private message and I will remove your (brilliant) Decalogue.
Pierre wrote:Ha ha, I remember that :D I joined AM in the very last moments of netjade's contributions here, but that was still pretty funny. I think it had to do with his Facebook profile picture, but the Great Ancients - nicolas, Nassim, Stephan, Honorio, Moonbeam or Henrik - might have a better picture.
Like one of the Great Ancients (OMG, that sounds awful) I can confirm this. He had a picture of his girlfriend on his Facebook profile. I remember one particular sleepless night chatting for hours with his/her on Facebook all the time believing that he was a girl. The next day I told to some friends of mine, "hey, last night I chatted with a German girl!" He apologized for this to us some months later. I miss netjade too…

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Re: AM demographics poll 2017 - genders

Post by Live in Phoenix » Sun Oct 15, 2017 3:22 pm

I have felt like music list-making is a male thing by and large (not a good thing, or a bad thing, just a thing). Regardless, the RYM post above suggests that rock criticism is dominated by male games, so to speak.

I had the notion that the AMF Top 100 Artists poll last year featured a submission entry or two or more by women, who were then dutifully ran off for not playing the usual games. (At any rate, I think some people got scared off.) Does that seem possible?

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Re: AM demographics poll 2017 - genders

Post by Pierre » Sun Oct 15, 2017 4:04 pm

jamieW wrote:That's what I remember, as well! He had an enigmatic, poetic way of writing (with a good sense of humor, too) that I enjoyed reading. Since I began tuning in during the later days (and caught up in the old forum), I remember him being a little frustrated that the forum was becoming more mainstream and not giving lesser known music a chance. His all-time albums list was great, though. He was even less mainstream than sonofsamiam and Mindrocker, and it'd be great to have his recommendations back again. (Though I don't think having Evanescence on my list is going to lure him back anytime soon.) :mrgreen:
Amen to that ;)
Honorio wrote: Yes, we have a regular female participant here. At least she is registered on RateYourMusic as female. But probably she is too shy to show up in this thread as the only girl on the Forum. But there's no need to be shy at all, her lists are excellent and her views on music are really refreshing.
Yeah, I was pretty surprised to see the female counter stuck at 0 as I was certain this particular member was female. Looks like I wasn't mistaken. I hope she'll vote.
Honorio wrote:
Pierre wrote:Ha ha, I remember that :D I joined AM in the very last moments of netjade's contributions here, but that was still pretty funny. I think it had to do with his Facebook profile picture, but the Great Ancients - nicolas, Nassim, Stephan, Honorio, Moonbeam or Henrik - might have a better picture.
Like one of the Great Ancients (OMG, that sounds awful) I can confirm this. He had a picture of his girlfriend on his Facebook profile. I remember one particular sleepless night chatting for hours with his/her on Facebook all the time believing that he was a girl. The next day I told to some friends of mine, "hey, last night I chatted with a German girl!" He apologized for this to us some months later. I miss netjade too…
That's probably when I got here, I have faint memories of that :) netjade, if you read us, know that you'll be welcome back anytime to teach the American kids who invaded the forum what real music is :music-rockon:
Live in Phoenix wrote:I had the notion that the AMF Top 100 Artists poll last year featured a submission entry or two or more by women, who were then dutifully ran off for not playing the usual games. (At any rate, I think some people got scared off.) Does that seem possible?
That was a painful event even to me. Karla came back for the albums poll apparently, but she, as I surmise she's a she, didn't vote here, or if she did she's a man, and having written this would get awkward. Anyway, to answer you, it's very possible people ran away, I wasn't far from doing so myself at one point, but I decided to change my mind and teach AMers a lesson by pushing classic rock and hair metal on AM instead (since I couldn't find an eligible pop list) as the members who were accused of spamming had posted mostly more mainstream oriented lists :mrgreen: I hope this event won't repeat.

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Re: AM demographics poll 2017 - genders

Post by prosecutorgodot » Sun Oct 15, 2017 4:49 pm

I find it hilarious that netjade seemed to troll on purpose about gender.
We should do 10 hottest men in music again XD

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Re: AM demographics poll 2017 - genders

Post by nicolas » Sun Oct 15, 2017 4:56 pm

netjade... I remember the day we met in real life with greg in 2009, a few days before he came to paris, we asked netjade if she would like to come along and meet us in Paris. That's when he made his coming out as a guy... But he didn't come to Paris eventually.

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Re: AM demographics poll 2017 - genders

Post by Pierre » Sun Oct 15, 2017 7:42 pm

FINALLY.

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Re: AM demographics poll 2017 - genders

Post by Pierre » Mon Oct 16, 2017 11:55 am

It looks like a barrier broke yesterday, as the female members are finally voting. Still, Dexter's prediction remains an optimistic one. What a gap!

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Re: AM demographics poll 2017 - genders

Post by BleuPanda » Mon Oct 16, 2017 12:38 pm

But hey; we have two members who identify outside the gender binary and feel comfortable enough to share (though I don't believe we know who the other one is), which I don't think is something you would see in most internet forums.

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Re: AM demographics poll 2017 - genders

Post by Pierre » Mon Oct 16, 2017 4:38 pm

BleuPanda wrote:But hey; we have two members who identify outside the gender binary and feel comfortable enough to share (though I don't believe we know who the other one is), which I don't think is something you would see in most internet forums.
Indeed. When I added that third choice, I didn't think it would actually be used.

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Re: AM demographics poll 2017 - genders

Post by Nassim » Mon Oct 16, 2017 8:25 pm

nicolas wrote:Hey guys, are your girlfriends / wives / sisters / mothers fond of LISTS ?
My wife hates lists.
My girlfriend is an Art History teacher in a US university (WAR EAGLE !!!), and after a bit over 2 years of dating, I still haven't been able to get her to pick a favorite work of art ever, let alone an unranked list...
Pierre wrote:
jamieW wrote:In fact, it was before my time, but wasn't one of the most legendary AM members - NJ - believed to be female for quite a while?
Ha ha, I remember that :D I joined AM in the very last moments of netjade's contributions here, but that was still pretty funny. I think it had to do with his Facebook profile picture, but the Great Ancients - nicolas, Nassim, Stephan, Honorio, Moonbeam or Henrik - might have a better picture.

Man, do I miss NJ. This guy was endlessly entertaining to read.
Great Ancient ? Guess I'll take that as a compliment, I do kinda look like Cthulhu when I'm hangover...
Anyway, funniest memories about nj was when a facebook messenge would essentially pop up and he'd go "QUICK, top 5 hip-hop albums of the 00s" or something like that. (though his answer started with 5. Puppetmastaz - Creature Funk... NAAAAAH just kidding"... why is everyone teasing me ? )

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Re: AM demographics poll 2017 - genders

Post by Pierre » Tue Oct 17, 2017 6:29 am

Nassim wrote:
Pierre wrote:
jamieW wrote:In fact, it was before my time, but wasn't one of the most legendary AM members - NJ - believed to be female for quite a while?
Ha ha, I remember that :D I joined AM in the very last moments of netjade's contributions here, but that was still pretty funny. I think it had to do with his Facebook profile picture, but the Great Ancients - nicolas, Nassim, Stephan, Honorio, Moonbeam or Henrik - might have a better picture.

Man, do I miss NJ. This guy was endlessly entertaining to read.
Great Ancient ? Guess I'll take that as a compliment, I do kinda look like Cthulhu when I'm hangover...
The little dark/ironic twist was intentional, for I just can't help myself, but it's not exactly original - Wikipedia members registered before 2002 refer to themselves as such, for instance, at least on the French Wikipedia. Though the Great Ancients from AM are necessarily "younger", as according to Wayback Machine, the forum was created in 2004... ;)
Nassim wrote: Anyway, funniest memories about nj was when a facebook messenge would essentially pop up and he'd go "QUICK, top 5 hip-hop albums of the 00s" or something like that. (though his answer started with 5. Puppetmastaz - Creature Funk... NAAAAAH just kidding"... why is everyone teasing me ? )
Interesting coming from him, as he was German or Austrian I think? I guess Puppetmastaz aren't critically well-perceived in their home country.

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Re: AM demographics poll 2017 - genders

Post by Nassim » Tue Oct 17, 2017 9:00 am

Pierre wrote:
Nassim wrote: Anyway, funniest memories about nj was when a facebook messenge would essentially pop up and he'd go "QUICK, top 5 hip-hop albums of the 00s" or something like that. (though his answer started with 5. Puppetmastaz - Creature Funk... NAAAAAH just kidding"... why is everyone teasing me ? )
Interesting coming from him, as he was German or Austrian I think? I guess Puppetmastaz aren't critically well-perceived in their home country.
Yeah he was kinda making fun of me since it is my 2nd favourite. We had Spank Rock's YoYoYoYoYo in common though, I think we are the only 2 who love this album around here.
Sorry for this hijacking of the topic though, typically masculine...

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Re: AM demographics poll 2017 - genders

Post by Pierre » Tue Oct 24, 2017 12:56 pm

1-week-away-from-deadline bump. Apparently, we officially have 3 female members.

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Re: AM demographics poll 2017 - genders

Post by Pierre » Tue Oct 31, 2017 7:21 am

Last bump before deadline tomorrow!

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