Moderately Acclaimed Albums 4 - Round 2.7

[Brad]

Round 2.7
Vote for your favorite album in each match-up.
Remember, anyone can vote as long as he or she has heard both albums!
Comments are encouraged but not absolutely necessary.
Deadline = August 12th at 10am EST

Match-ups:
1. Yes - The Yes Album vs. Bruce Springsteen - The Rising
2. Echo And The Bunnymen - Porcupine vs. Nico - Desertshore
3. Marisa Monte - Verde, Anil, Amarelo, Cor-de-Rosa e Carvão vs. Townes Van Zandt - Townes Van Zandt
4. Kronos Quartet - Pieces Of Africa vs. Vinícius de Moraes - Grabado en Buenos Aires con Maria Creuza y Toquinho

Pitch A Wang Dang Doodle!

[PlasticRam]

The Rising over The Yes Album. I think I gave Rising 8.5/10 and Yes 6/10. I do like the other Yes album in the competition.

[Brad]

Honorio's picks & comments:

Round 2.7

1. Yes - The Yes Album vs Bruce Springsteen - The Rising
We have already "Close to the Edge" on third round, it's refreshing to see a band not usually praised here getting so much recognition. "The Yes Album" began the golden period of Yes (followed by "Fragile" and their peak with "Close to the Edge") and it's a remarkable prog-rock album, including beautiful harmonies on "Your Move." But I'm going to choose the reunion of Springsteen with the E-Street Band in the wake of the 9/11 that offered, in Thom Jurek words for allmusic, "15 meditations - in grand rock & roll style - on his own way of making sense of the senseless." Probably the best Springsteen album of the last 20 years.

2. Echo & the Bunnymen - Porcupine vs. Nico - Desertshore
"Porcupine" was the first album by the Bunnymen I bought and I like it but: (1) it was placed in their discography between two albums I love ("Heaven Up Here" and especially "Ocean Rain") and I can't help but seeing it as a step back and (2) the B-side of the vinyl almost ruins an excellent A-side. Nico (the first of the HRS ladies of the week) offers instead a solid work, difficult, impenetrable and mysterious, inventing a gothic sound not related at all with any other sounds of her era, ending like an isolated and bizarre missing link between past and future (listen for instance the album closer: medieval meets avant-garde).

3. Marisa Monte - Verde, Anil, Amarelo, Cor-de-Rosa e Carvão vs. Townes Van Zandt - Townes Van Zandt
So sad for not voting for the second HRS lady, the talented Marisa Monte, especially when her album is simultaneously delicious (these wonderful Brazilian samba rhythms and bossa chords! and her warm and versatile voice!) and adventurous (trying always to innovate and avoid the obvious). But I love the third album by Townes Van Zandt with his trademark subdued performances of highly emotional material. It contains masterpieces like "For the Shake of the Song," "Waiting Around to Die" (these two were re-recordings of songs from his first album), "Lungs" or "Fare Thee Well Miss Carrousel."

4. Kronos Quartet - Pieces of Africa vs. Vinícius de Moraes - Grabado en Buenos Aires con Maria Creuza y Toquinho
The Kronos Quartet album is not only a good idea on paper (creating something entirely new as African classical music) but it works perfectly, and not only the fascinating dialogs between the string quartet and African instruments (like the kora on "Tilliboyo") but the tracks with only strings like "White Man Sleeps." But the second Brazilian album of the week is my own nomination and one of my ever favourites. Only three voices (Vinícius de Moraes, Maria de Creuza and Toquinho) and three musicians (Toquinho on guitar and two Argentinian studio musicians on drums and bass) and a wonderful bunch of songs from the inspired pen of De Moraes on lyrics working with different composers (most notably the great Antônio Carlos Jobim) is more than enough.

[Henry]

1. Yes - The Yes Album is preferred over Bruce Springsteen - The Rising

I am very much a Springsteen fan. Much more so after seeing him in concert at the HP Pavillion a few years ago. The Rising is very touching album that is clearly a grower. But for me, the intrumentation, musical composition and vocals from the The Yes Album are so spectacular that I am compelled to vote for it here.

In my view, The Yes Album and Fragile are the two best offerings by far from this beloved band.

Close to the Edge has some excellent work. But in my view, Close to the Edge signalled the drop off that became even more clear in the Tales from Topographic Oceans album.

So, I am having some difficulty with the view that because what I consider an inferior album by Yes has made it to the next round, it makes sense to others here to vote against an even better Yes album. I am confident that others do not share my preference between the two Yes albums, but I do not recall reading a convincing articulation that supports such a preference. I urge Honorio to explain why he believes that Close to the Edge was the pinnacle of their work. I look forward to listening again to Close to the Edge with Honorio's perspective in mind.

I have read the Wikipedia article which clearly states that most critics agree with Honorio's perspective, including the following about the "Close to the Edge" album: "The album is still widely regarded as a major achievement in progressive rock circles, as well as a benchmark by which most progressive rock music is measured, including the individual and collective works by the members of Yes themselves. It is routinely cited in music polls and by progressive rock musicians as one of the greatest progressive rock albums of all time. "

I have always found the title track and the song "And You and I" impressive, moving and pleasureable. "I Get Up, I Get Down is also a winner for me.

But, the other tracks on Close to the Edge never really brought me much joy or pleasure. So, to the extent that they have done so for others, I would appreciate some clues as to why and how. Thanks!

[Jirin]

Townes Van Zandt - Townes Van Zandt 97
Kronos Quartet - Pieces of Africa 87
Vincicius de MOraes - Gravado Ao Vivi No Canecao 85
Echo and the Bunnymen - Porcupine 82
Marisa Monte - Verde, Anil, Amarelo, Cor-de-rosa e Carvao 78
Nico - Desertshore 70
Yes - The Yes Album 70
Bruce Springsteen - the Rising 60

[Stephan]

1. Townes Van Zandt - Townes Van Zandt
2. Bruce Springsteen - The Rising
3. Maria Creuza, Vinícius de Moraes & Toquinho - La Fusa
4. Marisa Monte - Verde, amarelo, anil, cor-de-rosa e carvão
5. Nico - Desertshore
6. Yes - The Yes Album
7. Kronos Quartet - Pieces Of Africa
8. Echo And The Bunnymen - Porcupine

[Brad]

In response to Henry re: Yes - I will be voting for The Yes Album here (easily). Ultimately, however, I prefer Close To The Edge, which I have ranked as my #43 all-time album.

I'm not great at describing my feelings towards songs & albums, but I can tell you all three of the songs on Close To The Edge reside in my top 1000 all-time (incidentally, I find it interesting that you seem to break the song "Close To The Edge" into separate parts [like "I Get Up I Get Down"] while I prefer to consider the entire piece as a whole).

From The Yes Album, both "Perpetual Change" and "Starship Trooper" are highly ranked on my charts (and "I've Seen All Good People" is just outside the top 1000).

The clincher for me, ultimately, is what I feel may be Yes's finest moment - "Siberian Khatru." This song encompasses everything I love about Yes in the early '70's - simply epic, that pounding/driving Squire bassline, meticulous Howe guitar-work, some dynamic hooks and classical stylings, all topped by Anderson's trademark vocals (and I have no idea what he's singing about nor do I care)... this song is relentless for 9 solid minutes. I couldn't help but notice you didn't mention it... not a fan?

[jamieW]

Bruce Springsteen - The Rising
Nico – Desertshore
Townes Van Zandt - Townes Van Zandt
Kronos Quartet - Pieces Of Africa

[DaveC]

1. Bruce Springsteen - The Rising
2. Nico - Desertshore
3. Marisa Monte - Verde, Anil, Amarelo, Cor-de-Rosa e Carvão
4. Vinícius de Moraes - Grabado en Buenos Aires con Maria Creuza y Toquinho

[Michel]

1. tie ?
2. Echo And The Bunnymen - Porcupine
3. Townes Van Zandt - Townes Van Zandt
4. Kronos Quartet - Pieces Of Africa

[HRS]

It's all okay, Honorio! Shed some light on these girls was what mattered the most.

1. Yes - The Yes Album vs. Bruce Springsteen - The Rising
2. Echo And The Bunnymen - Porcupine vs. Nico - Desertshore
3. Marisa Monte - Verde, Anil, Amarelo, Cor-de-Rosa e Carvão vs. Townes Van Zandt - Townes Van Zandt
4. Kronos Quartet - Pieces Of Africa vs. Vinícius de Moraes - Grabado en Buenos Aires con Maria Creuza y Toquinho

The latter two were the toughest ones. Townes shared the same amount of highs, but was overall more consistent that Marisa's record -- even though I'm the one who nominated it. Kronos was just beautiful sonically, but I love Vinicius's poetry so much. And I've been currently in a Vinicius's poetry mood. Never enjoyed Echo and the Bunnymen as much as others; find them one of the least attractive of the major post-punk bands. Nico fit better my mood. There's darkness, but at the same time flashes of light through her doomed harmonium produced by John Cale's contributions and it fills me with hope and comfort, rather than the pure despair that is mostly attributed to her trilogy. Joni used to sing that there's comfort in melancholy and when Nico sings "you are beautiful and you are alone" in 'Afraid', as if her beauty had been the source of all emptiness of spirit and a boundary to the fullness of her being, I can't help but feel that behind all the avant-garde production and cryptic lyrics there's an honest voice yearning to understand itself better as a human being; trying to connect to itself to understand who she is, who are the ones who surround her, her german roots and where she stands now.

[Stephan]

I'll be going on holiday for two weeks, so here are my votes for the next two weeks:

2.8:
Miles Davis

3.1:
1. The Isley Brothers - The Heat Is On
2. The Sound - Jeopardy
3. Cesária Évora - Miss Perfumado
4. Low - Things We Lost In The Fire
5. Ondatrópica - Ondatrópica
6. Yes - Close To The Edge
7. The Cure - The Head On The Door
8. Eels - Electro-Shock Blues

[nicolas]

The Yes Album over The Rising (I hate the production on that album)
Townes over Marisa (like both)

[Brad]

I'll be going on holiday for two weeks, so here are my votes for the next two weeks:

got it Stephan - Thanks!

[Kingoftonga]

1. Yes - The Yes Album vs. Bruce Springsteen - The Rising

I never thought I'd be in a position to say that Yes has a more compact, unified album than the Boss, but that seems to be the case here. The Rising goes on forever, and could do with a little slimming.

2. Echo And The Bunnymen - Porcupine vs. Nico - Desertshore

Big fan of both, but I'm in an art-rock mood this week.

3. Marisa Monte - Verde, Anil, Amarelo, Cor-de-Rosa e Carvão vs. Townes Van Zandt - Townes Van Zandt

It surprises me that I'm voting against Townes van Zandt, whom I like quite a lot. But the arrangements of Marisa Monte's songs just felt a lot fresher to me.

4. Kronos Quartet - Pieces Of Africa vs. Vinícius de Moraes - Grabado en Buenos Aires con Maria Creuza y Toquinho

Not crazy about either; the Kronos Quartet has some corny bits, but is ultimately more memorable.

[Nassim]

1. Yes - The Yes Album

I'm not a fan of either, but if I had to listen to one I'd go for Yes

[Brad]

My picks:

1. Yes - The Yes Album vs. Bruce Springsteen - The Rising
2. Echo And The Bunnymen - Porcupine vs. Nico - Desertshore
3. Marisa Monte - Verde, Anil, Amarelo, Cor-de-Rosa e Carvão vs. Townes Van Zandt - Townes Van Zandt
4. Kronos Quartet - Pieces Of Africa vs. Vinícius de Moraes - Grabado en Buenos Aires con Maria Creuza y Toquinho

Thanks!

[Brad]

23 hours left to vote!

[Brad]

Results
13 total voters:
Brad
DaveC
Henry
Honorio
HRS
jamieW
Jirin
kingoftonga
Michel
Nassim
nicolas
PlasticRam
Stephan

Winners:
1. Yes - The Yes Album over Bruce Springsteen - The Rising 7-5
2. Nico - Desertshore over Echo And The Bunnymen - Porcupine 6-3
3. Townes Van Zandt - Townes Van Zandt over Marisa Monte - Verde, Anil, Amarelo, Cor-de-Rosa e Carvão 7-2
4. Vinícius de Moraes - Grabado en Buenos Aires con Maria Creuza y Toquinho over Kronos Quartet - Pieces Of Africa 5-4

Round 2.8 up soon!

[Henry]

In response to Henry re: Yes - I will be voting for The Yes Album here (easily). Ultimately, however, I prefer Close To The Edge, which I have ranked as my #43 all-time album.

I'm not great at describing my feelings towards songs & albums, but I can tell you all three of the songs on Close To The Edge reside in my top 1000 all-time (incidentally, I find it interesting that you seem to break the song "Close To The Edge" into separate parts [like "I Get Up I Get Down"] while I prefer to consider the entire piece as a whole).

From The Yes Album, both "Perpetual Change" and "Starship Trooper" are highly ranked on my charts (and "I've Seen All Good People" is just outside the top 1000).

The clincher for me, ultimately, is what I feel may be Yes's finest moment - "Siberian Khatru." This song encompasses everything I love about Yes in the early '70's - simply epic, that pounding/driving Squire bassline, meticulous Howe guitar-work, some dynamic hooks and classical stylings, all topped by Anderson's trademark vocals (and I have no idea what he's singing about nor do I care)... this song is relentless for 9 solid minutes. I couldn't help but notice you didn't mention it... not a fan?

Actually, I am a fan of Siberian Khatru, and it ranks at @ 4200 in my list of all time faves. But, compared to the songs on the Yes Album, I find Siberian Khatru a bit long-winded at times, and I find the vocals a tiny bit grating (perhaps because of a lack of variation over such a long song).

[Honorio]

Hello, Henry, sorry for my late reply but I was enjoying a holidays in Ireland with no computers allowed (by the way the trip was wonderful, beautiful country and very nice people, wonderful landscapes – just see above the impressive cliffs of Moher – and lots of excellent music on pubs and streets).
About Yes first of all I should say that (exaggerating of course) I grew up hating that band. When I was 13-14 years-old (so in 1978-1979) each one in my group of friends had a favourite band. José P. was a fan of Yes, Santi liked Genesis, José F. Led Zeppelin and me, I liked King Crimson (yes, I was the weird one). We used to go to each other houses, listen to music for hours and had funny chats trying to despise the favourite bands of every other. You know, this kind of silly things that teenagers do. So I could not like Yes, I was rooting for King Crimson. When our team broke during the early 80s (by this time our favourite bands had changed, mine was then The Clash) I began to enjoy also the music of Genesis and Led Zeppelin. But I never really got into Yes and I can't explain properly why. I can detect many defects on them but not so different to the ones I can find on any other prog-rock band, including Genesis and of course King Crimson.
Some years after I began looking for music lists (much before the glorious days of Acclaimed Music came) and in the early 90s I found a list from Vox magazine called The 100 Records That Shook the World that ignited my obsessive-compulsive disorder about music lists. I bought (almost) every item on this list including "Close to the Edge." I liked it quite a lot, especially the pastoral "And You and I" but also the multi-part title theme (especially the organ solo near the end and more specifically the bass part played by Squire during this solo) and of course the style-defining "Siberian Khatru" previously praised here and appearing in Korg and Jackson's lists. No one can deny the instrumental proficiency and creativity on this album.
But it seems that I didn't like it enough to make me go deeper into the Yes output. The previous two albums remained as a blurred memory of these auditions at the room of my friend José P. That's why I included the Yes songs in the "never-heard-before" section when I listened-reviewed your all-time list, even if I probably listened to them then. So I was probably unfair to label "Close to the Edge" as their peak without having listened with the same close attention to the previous two albums. After listening the three albums in a row I can say now that both "The Yes Album" and "Fragile" are almost on the same level, it was more a question of exposure. Anyway I still prefer staying "Close to the Edge" (not in the case of the cliffs of Moher, too dangerous).

[Henry]

Some years after I began looking for music lists (much before the glorious days of Acclaimed Music came) and in the early 90s I found a list from Vox magazine called The 100 Records That Shook the World that ignited my obsessive-compulsive disorder about music lists. I bought (almost) every item on this list including "Close to the Edge." I liked it quite a lot, especially the pastoral "And You and I" but also the multi-part title theme (especially the organ solo near the end and more specifically the bass part played by Squire during this solo) and of course the style-defining "Siberian Khatru" previously praised here and appearing in Korg and Jackson's lists. No one can deny the instrumental proficiency and creativity on this album.
But it seems that I didn't like it enough to make me go deeper into the Yes output. The previous two albums remained as a blurred memory of these auditions at the room of my friend José P. That's why I included the Yes songs in the "never-heard-before" section when I listened-reviewed your all-time list, even if I probably listened to them then. So I was probably unfair to label "Close to the Edge" as their peak without having listened with the same close attention to the previous two albums. After listening the three albums in a row I can say now that both "The Yes Album" and "Fragile" are almost on the same level, it was more a question of exposure. Anyway I still prefer staying "Close to the Edge" (not in the case of the cliffs of Moher, too dangerous).

Thanks so much for once again enlightening me with your beautifully articulated perspective. I must place Ireland a bit higher on my anticipated destinations after reading about your time there.